III. GCCG Nations Cup 2009 (Talk)

Events taking place on GCCG.
Smaug
Posts: 259
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Location: Germany

Post by Smaug » Tue Nov 18, 2008 12:18 am

Hi hexdrake,

it was not a direct rely to your post, it was just below it ;-), so I was not abusing you.

Our game was indeed special, and i think you will share my opion that it would have ended in 99% with a victory for me if i played normal. And additionally the faster the play the better the chances for a high victory because without radi it is very hard for you to get more than 20 mp. Indeed our c v cc took a very long time, that was not necessary, but i think there the slow play was from both sides.

It might be manuel was a little bit pissed he lost against me (loosing all chances on the title) but in my eyes his lost had nothing to do with slow play, we both exsausted and played at least 5 may be 6 rounds. That is a normal number of turns especially with him starting with 3 companies.

Any way a limitation would be nice, think turn limitation would be simplest, i real games i proposed once to play with a chess clock once ;-)

CU

Heiner

HeXDrake
Posts: 15
Joined: Tue Jan 30, 2007 8:31 am
Location: Jyväskylä, Finland

Post by HeXDrake » Tue Nov 18, 2008 12:25 am

Smaug wrote: it was not a direct rely to your post, it was just below it ;-), so I was not abusing you.

Our game was indeed special, and i think you will share my opion that it would have ended in 99% with a victory for me if i played normal. And additionally the faster the play the better the chances for a high victory because without radi it is very hard for you to get more than 20 mp. Indeed our c v cc took a very long time, that was not necessary, but i think there the slow play was from both sides.


Just making sure ;) Our game was what it was and u certainly would've won if...etc. My original post had nothing to do with our game :)
"Why do I get to be Mr. Pink?" --Mr. Pink

marcos
Posts: 2010
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Location: Córdoba, Argentina

Post by marcos » Tue Nov 18, 2008 1:10 am

Smaug wrote:Hi hexdrake,

it was not a direct rely to your post, it was just below it ;-), so I was not abusing you.

Our game was indeed special, and i think you will share my opion that it would have ended in 99% with a victory for me if i played normal. And additionally the faster the play the better the chances for a high victory because without radi it is very hard for you to get more than 20 mp. Indeed our c v cc took a very long time, that was not necessary, but i think there the slow play was from both sides.

It might be manuel was a little bit pissed he lost against me (loosing all chances on the title) but in my eyes his lost had nothing to do with slow play, we both exsausted and played at least 5 may be 6 rounds. That is a normal number of turns especially with him starting with 3 companies.

Any way a limitation would be nice, think turn limitation would be simplest, i real games i proposed once to play with a chess clock once ;-)

CU

Heiner
Heiner, you are not even close to be slow compared to get to 15 mins per org phase and 40 mins per turn, so i think it is very good to have you around online :)...

Balin
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Post by Balin » Tue Nov 18, 2008 8:25 am

I think we are having an interesting chat here. Perhaps Wigy should introduce some rules changes for next GCCG Worlds... or maybe it's just that one guy should change his behaviour (by the way, I'm pretty sure that guy is not you, Heiner).

Anyway, my proposal about 2-hours time-limited games concerns next Nations Cup only, so let's face the subjetc, please: do you guys agree? or do you not?

Master Tuk says there will be no jugdes around, that's right, but they are not needed since both players will know what time the game begins. Two hours later, time is over, they play last turns, and that's all. Quite easy. Keep in mind that I'm not proposing this to counter stalling players only, but to improve play experience and also to save time we all need to do something else. Besides, it is very well known that some decks take advantage of unlimited-time games, and it's necessary to balance this too.
__

Let them come! There is one dwarf yet in Moria that still draws breath!

HeXDrake
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Location: Jyväskylä, Finland

Post by HeXDrake » Tue Nov 18, 2008 10:27 am

Balin wrote:
Anyway, my proposal about 2-hours time-limited games concerns next Nations Cup only, so let's face the subjetc, please: do you guys agree? or do you not?
In this years Gccg-champs all my games ended with the time limit being used up. And as i listened to other players almost all faced the same issue: running out of time. I'm not saying that if it was good or bad for their decks or their strategies, i'm just pointing out a fact.

But as far as the live tourneys i've been in (which aren't many in numbers) counts, there hasn't been these kind of issues of this magnitude. I'm starting to believe that this all roots from the idea of it being too easy to manipulate time and opponent from behind the monitor. When u're face-to-face with your opponent, u tend to kind of respect him, right? And it is easier and not so time-consuming to parley with the judge also.

So, what Balin here proposes could be the answer for online gaming imho. Of course the 2 hour limit itself can be discussed and polled to meet the req's and expectations of this community.
"Why do I get to be Mr. Pink?" --Mr. Pink

Smaug
Posts: 259
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Location: Germany

Post by Smaug » Wed Nov 19, 2008 5:17 pm

For me a 2 hour limit is good!

Manuel
Posts: 289
Joined: Thu Aug 10, 2006 11:31 am

Post by Manuel » Wed Nov 19, 2008 7:20 pm

Yes, 2 hour game is ok. And I agree with Balin that we need no judge for that.

Alter Tuk
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Location: Germany

Post by Alter Tuk » Thu Nov 20, 2008 8:58 am

As nobody is really against it, for this years Nations Cup we have a time limit of 2 hours per game.
[url=http://gccg.sourceforge.net/]Come to GCCG or die a lonely death.[/url]

marcos
Posts: 2010
Joined: Sun Feb 18, 2007 5:41 pm
Location: Córdoba, Argentina

Post by marcos » Thu Nov 20, 2008 11:02 am

why do you think that a staller wont take advatage of the time limit, even when it is a 2 hours limit?

HeXDrake
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Location: Jyväskylä, Finland

Post by HeXDrake » Thu Nov 20, 2008 12:11 pm

marcos wrote:why do you think that a staller wont take advatage of the time limit, even when it is a 2 hours limit?
Well, in this kind of judge-free environment it is a problem, but if there would be a judge, 2 hour limit would give more time for the judge to evaluate the game and its fluctuation.

And what comes to the known staller(s), i would give them some special treatment, like judge surveillance for the next 10 years or so :twisted:
"Why do I get to be Mr. Pink?" --Mr. Pink

marcos
Posts: 2010
Joined: Sun Feb 18, 2007 5:41 pm
Location: Córdoba, Argentina

Post by marcos » Thu Nov 20, 2008 12:59 pm

Well, in this kind of judge-free environment it is a problem, but if there would be a judge, 2 hour limit would give more time for the judge to evaluate the game and its fluctuation.
yes, that is what i mean... i think it is even worse to play without judge and time limit, because there is going to be no one who can control a staller player...

Trossell
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Location: Oulu, Finland

Post by Trossell » Thu Nov 20, 2008 2:19 pm

Great to see HexDrake how you are framing my slow play as consciously using 'tactics' to take advantage of the time limit :? .

I think a 2 hour limit is fine for tourney games, and I don't think a judge is needed to keep watch over these games (which would be hard to achieve in nations cup games anyway). I will try to correct my evil ways and deal with less thinking time. However, please refrain from engaging in a public smear campaign because of your frustration.
"Generally speaking, the errors in religion are dangerous; those in philosophy only ridiculous."
-David Hume-

HeXDrake
Posts: 15
Joined: Tue Jan 30, 2007 8:31 am
Location: Jyväskylä, Finland

Post by HeXDrake » Thu Nov 20, 2008 7:18 pm

Trossell wrote:Great to see HexDrake how you are framing my slow play as consciously using 'tactics' to take advantage of the time limit :? .
Well, no names were drawn here, so... but it's good to know that u feel u're the one ;) And actually we've had this conversation before and you've admitted that some of this is tactics. And i don't blame u, i'm just pointing out a fact that needs attention. Increasing of time limit and proper penalties are things that i'm after (+the fun that ppl get out of playing), not u ;)
"Why do I get to be Mr. Pink?" --Mr. Pink

Beornd
Posts: 168
Joined: Fri Feb 09, 2007 5:15 pm

Post by Beornd » Fri Nov 21, 2008 10:19 am

1st - I agree with 2 h timelimit

2nd - Stop trash talk! Whats happen here - we only play just for fun. A few players take the game themselves to seriously.

Be careful for the nationscup - austria is a leading doping nation :lol:

Manuel
Posts: 289
Joined: Thu Aug 10, 2006 11:31 am

Post by Manuel » Fri Nov 21, 2008 1:03 pm

The 2-hour limit will at least stop me from wasting my time in a 3 hour game that could be played in 2 hours. And it gives me a reason to rush my opponent if I feel he's playing too slow. I'm happy with the measure.

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