Re: Creatures played as an automatic-attack (playabilty conditions)
Posted: Sun Sep 01, 2019 9:49 am
@Christoph edit your above post to say "Morgul Rats" not just "morgul" other than that I agree
yours Vastor
yours Vastor
MECCG Discussion Forum
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https://councilofelrond.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=145&t=3658
I agree. I think this is the correct interpretation of "normal" as ruled in the CRF.Khamul the Easterling wrote: ↑Sun Sep 01, 2019 8:51 am From these, I'd form the following proposal for this year's ARV:
Creatures that can be played as an automatic-attack and that must be normally playable keyed to or normally keyed to a specific site by type or region, may be only played if these requirements are met as written on their card text.
Framsburg wrote:Automatic-attacks: When a company enters this site, opponent may play one creature from his hand that is treated in all ways as the site's automatic-attack (if defeated, creature is discarded). It must normally be playable keyed to a Ruins & Lairs, Shadow-hold, single wilderness, or Shadow-land.
Wild Fell Beast is not normally playable keyed to Shadow-land, instead two shadow-lands in site path are required. So Wild Fell Beast cannot be played as an automatic attack at Framsburg.Wild Fell Beast wrote:Two Shadow-lands in site path are required.
I think it's important to note that (A) "normal" includes the card's own effects but not other cards effects, but not necessarily non-effects of those cards, and (B) "normal" doesn't specifically exclude other effects of the rules themselves.CRF wrote:Normal means as written on the card, not considering other card's effects. Note that this definition only applies to effects referring to card texts.
I believe has been ruled that an attack keyed to double Z is also considered keyed to Z (but not to *a* Z).
This suggests that parsing interpretation of Framsburg would matter.CRF wrote: Elven Cloak
Can cancel a strike keyed to one, two or more Wilderness.
...
Angmar Arises, In Darkness Bind Them, and Reaching Shadow may not be used to play creatures keyed to double shadow-lands.
That's a misinterpretation of the earlier sets. A Creature may be "keyed" to wilderness such that it can be cancelled by Elven Cloak and that Creature may also also require two wilderness in its site path. Similarly, Wild Fell Beast can "keyed" to Shadow-land and also require 2 Shadow-lands in the site path. Then the MELE rules were updated to mention "keying" to "double" region-types. You can see how later MELE creatures don't mention 2 regions being required.
Huh. My impression (above) was that Morgul-rats was not considering the "effect" of Doors of Night, just whether or not it was in play. This ICE ruling is more restrictive.ICE Digest 62 wrote: Question: Can someone explain the meaning of "normally" keyable? I mean, consider the following statements: Normal means as written on the card, not considering other cards effects.
3. If DON is in play (or a character is wounded), Morgul-rats can be played as an auto-attack at certain under-deeps sites since they are normally keyable to the shadow/dark holds.
Answer: No, because you have to consider other cards effects to make Morgul-rats playable, so it isn't normally playable.