Dwar Unleashed

[Thorsten the Traveller]

I like resources that change site/region type - see my Great Bats proposal - to create some interaction, but I think this leaving a trail thing is just too much, for play purpose (multiple dd's or wilder) and for Dwar, up to the point where it's rather grotesk.
Anyway, can you change them in both wilderness and dd's at will? So, one wilder, one dd etc.? (not sure why you would want that, but ok). Also doesn't it mean, if you make them dd's, that your other companies moving after this guy get everything detainment? that's no good.

Dwar is no Sauron, he's just a guy with a ring. It's the hounds that make it a wild(erniss) affair.

So, I prefer the wolf keyer version. But, not to be condemned to using wolves with Dwar, maybe we can state simply: each region where Dwar is may also be considered wilderness and any wolf may be keyed there. Go to Minas Tirith and play orc-lieutenants there...

[Bandobras Took]

I'm fine with changing the region types as a discard clause, because it will likely require a minimum of two in play (discard your only one and Dwar can no longer move with Region movement, and so will be forced to return to his site of origin). I also vote for the second version.

[Frodo]

I admit it's a really far-out ability, but it has some incredible possibilities in terms of deck design, as Jambo intimated.

All right, let's try it then. If it's too nutty, we'll hold Thorsten's idea in mind, though I would add: "...and all adjacent regions." In fact, this solution would be a lot easier for players to keep track of, since the domains are just based on Dwar's current position! Yet, it would be missing the resource benefit of changing the domains to shield his movement from creatures...
and also take away from the "giant strides of dwar" idea...

I'm thinking we try option 1 for testing and have 2 for a backup plan. Is that okay? Note that option 2 does not require any build-up of power on the part of Dwar either. I don't see a need for any lines about detainment.
1)
Discard this card during your movement/hazard phase: Any named regions Dwar is moving through may be changed to a Dark-Domain or Wilderness until your next organization phase.
2)
Discard this card if Dwar is not moving: Dwar's current region and all adjacent regions change to a Dark-Domain or Wilderness until your next organization phase.

The reason why it can't be both dark AND wildernesses is because it would be extremely difficult to remember which named regions exactly were changed into what domain.

Frodo

[Frodo]

Actually, I'm talking to Jambo now... we decided option 2 is better.


Frodo

[Jambo]

Ok, something like:

Playable on Dwar during the organization phase (if Dwar is your Ringwraith). Even without a mode card, Dwar’s company may use region movement equal to 1 region plus a region for every Wolf faction or two Wolf allies in play. All Wolf allies in his company gain the ranger skill, may play Hounds of Sauron and Our Own Wolves (which never creates an attack this way), and their non-Ringwraith controllers may be in Dwar’s company. Tap a Wolf faction to take Our Own Wolves from your discard pile to your hand. You may discard this card if Dwar is not moving: Dwar's current region and all adjacent regions change to Dark-Domains or Wildernesses until your next organization phase.

For example, you can set one off during the organization phase before moving to make certain regions safer for Dwar, or you can let one go during the site phase to potentially change your opponent's regions of travel. Btw, the region movement range isn't cumulative with additional Dwar Unleashed cards.

[Thorsten the Traveller]

yes looks good. Not sure if/how that would work though, movement is declared at end of org.phase, can you then after that still discard this card?
One reason I preferred the type-changer connected to the site where Dwar is, is because I don't like the discard in respons to elf-lord idea. Glad we got that fixed. Adjacent is still very good, for example for Dragon country that contains almost all sites (let the guy squat in Northern Rhovanion), it all depends on your recycle ability, like I said, other companies can follow in his trail and get everything detainment.

[Frodo]

Not sure if/how that would work though, movement is declared at end of org.phase, can you then after that still discard this card?

My understanding is that the only actions you may take during the end of the org phase are actions that say they must be taken then. Otherwise, you could split and reform companies then, right?

Final version on "Post tournament card corrections" topic.

Frodo

[Frodo]

If nobody has strong objections, Marcos pointed out that one big problem with this card is the inability to transfer the wolves.

Therefore, Jambo, let's make this line read:

"All Wolf allies in his company gain the ranger skill, can be transferred during the organization phase, and may play Hounds of Sauron and Our Own Wolves (which never creates an attack this way). Their controllers may also be in Dwar’s company."

Frodo

[Jambo]

Makes sense, and is actually a very critical aspect to this card. Good catch Marcos.

[marcos]

If nobody has strong objections, Marcos pointed out that one big problem with this card is the inability to transfer the wolves.

Therefore, Jambo, let's make this line read:

"All Wolf allies in his company gain the ranger skill, can be transferred during the organization phase, and may play Hounds of Sauron and Our Own Wolves (which never creates an attack this way). Their controllers may also be in Dwar’s company."

Frodo

by the way, if you want to save some space on Dwar unleashed, yesterday i suggested a new Orc-mounts V that allows a player to transfer wolf allies... take a look at showcase forum...

[Frodo]

Okay gentlemen, I think I'm making some mistakes. I mentioned this in another post, but perhaps in my efforts to make cards that don't suck, that do everything they can to be COOL and BALANCED without needing a host of other cards in play, I'm overdoing the abilities of a card.

I'm not talking so much about text. Cards like Tower Raided or Great Goblin or Morannon have a narrative to them that you can follow. I'm talking about cards that simply **list abilities**, and lots of them, especially ones that did not exist before and create several new concepts at once.

After reading Marcos's very very cool Orc-Mounts (V) (really! this is quite inventive!) I'm convinced that we should move a lot of the abilities from Dwar Unleashed onto this card. In that way, as another play (maybe Boder?) said in another forum, the game becomes more about the *combos between cards*, rather than one card that does it all, especially when the desired combo card is easily playable. (Marcos, can you try adding some more abilities to this one too, like the ranger ability and perhaps the spell-casting?)

The only problem with this method is that it really hurts the playabilty of Dwar for Virtual Set 1, since Orc-Mounts isn't in Set 1.

Therefore, I would strongly suggest we remove another card from Set 1 to make room for Orc-Mounts... and this card should probably be I Know Much About You. Reason-being, this card's new incarnation is completely untested anyway. So we don't really lose anything by swapping it with Orc-Mounts. Second, I would really prefer to have mostly complete strategies released in sets--not strategies that are so obviously lacking in strength. This would mean that other set 1 cards that don't combo right away with set 1 should be sacrificed for necessary combo cards (Anduin River comes to mind).

What do we think?

Marcos, move Orc-Mounts here to development and let's hash this out.

Frodo

[Thorsten the Traveller]

On the one hand I agree, certainly with this card, but on the other hand Frodo let's be realistic, part of the issue for starting with Virtuals, or in fact any dreamcard effort, was also the fact that difficult cardmanagment can ruin alot of fun in this game. There's different sides to it, the Hannibal camp: I love it when a plan comes together. And there's the Buddhists: take it as comes. A balance is needed.

But, it's not difficult to see why this balance has been disturbed, maybe, in your and others' opinion. Have you seen the amount of ideas people have come up with? Oh boy! Which also means, you might end up with about a thousand virtual cards if you're not careful, and each slot seems valuable. Designing stuff for the sideboard should be avoided.

[Jambo]

Ok, let's have a go with the Orc-mounts idea.

So we'd have Dwar Unleashed (trimmed):

Dwar Unleashed V:
Playable on Dwar during the organization phase (if Dwar is your Ringwraith). Even without a mode card, Dwar’s company may use region movement equal to 1 region plus a region for every Wolf faction or two Wolf allies in play. All Wolf allies in his company gain the ranger skill, , and their non-Ringwraith controllers may be in Dwar’s company. You may discard this card if Dwar is not moving: Dwar's current region and all adjacent regions change to Dark-Domains or Wildernesses until your next organization phase.

Is the intention for this to be just "...in play" i.e. could be in play by your opponent, or, should this be "...you have in play"?

And then Orc-mounts:

Orc-mounts V:
Wolf Faction
1 MP
Playable at any tapped or untapped site with a Wolf automatic-attack if the influence check is greater than 10. Standard Modifications: +3 if Dwar is your Ringwraith or Saruman is your Fallen Wizard. Your Wolf allies may play Hounds of Sauron and Our Own Wolves (which never creates an attack this way). Tap this faction to allow one Wolf ally to be transferred from one character to another during your organization phase or to take Our Own Wolves from your discard pile into your hand.

If it's playable at a Haven, then perhaps all we'll see is Dwar squatting for his tapping ability, and when not tapping, playing 3 MPs worth of factions.

[Thorsten the Traveller]

agreed on the playability of Orc-mounts.
I'd say: every ally/faction you have in play.
What does it mean: wolf-allies can play the magic? Can they make the cc for you? I liked it when Dwar could play these cards, but now any bugger with a wolf and this faction can play them?
Can you tap faction at any time and unlimited (i.e. 3x per turn)!? better pack your Lady and some recyclers...I would limit it to once per turn total, not per faction, otherwise the beasts can get +9 prowess against an attack.

[Jambo]

Good comments Thorsten. After a bit of re-arranging.

Dwar Unleashed V:
Playable on Dwar during the organization phase (if Dwar is your Ringwraith). Even without a mode card, Dwar’s company may use region movement equal to 1 region plus a region for every Wolf faction or two Wolf allies in play. Any character controlling a Wolf ally may be in the same company as Dwar and all Wolf allies in Dwar’s company gain the ranger skill. Dwar may play Our Own Wolves and Hounds of Sauron. You may discard this card if Dwar is not moving: Dwar's current region and all adjacent regions change to Dark-Domains or Wildernesses until your next organization phase.

And Orc-mounts:

Orc-mounts V:
Wolf Faction
1 MP
Playable at any tapped or untapped site with a Wolf automatic-attack if the influence check is greater than 10. Standard Modifications: +3 if Dwar is your Ringwraith or Saruman is your Fallen Wizard. Tap Orc-mounts during your organization phase to allow one Wolf ally to be immediately transferred from one character to another. You may tap one Orc-mounts during your end-of-turn phase to take Our Own Wolves from your discard pile into your hand. Our Own Wolves no longer creates an attack against your companies.