Eddy in Fate's Tide

[Mordakai]

Hi everybody, question for you: How does "Eddy in Fate's Tide interact with the Worthy Hills? Options:

a) Eddy overrides Worthy Hills and taps them when played.
b) Worthy hills override Eddy and remains untapped. Multiple Eddy's can be played, as it is not stated "cannot be duplicated on a given place".
c) As tapping the Worthy Hills is part of the "cost" of the card, and the Worthy Hills cannot be tapped, Eddy cannot be played (doesn't make sense for me, other cards with that requirement can be played there, Maker's Map, for example)
d) Any other option I can't imagine...

[Ringbearer]

Considering how the Red Hills deck works, I would say Eddy doesnt tap the site.

[Mordakai]

Yes, I think B) is the correct one, but as Red Hills usually includes Maker's Map and Tempest of Fire but not this one, it made me think about the "never untaps for you" thing. Most probably the reason is the Balrog movement to the Worthy Hills being difficult, and not a rules problem...

[Konrad Klar]

Balrog specific. Playable during the site phase on an untapped site if The Balrog is there; the site cannot be an Under-deeps site or surface site thereof. Tap The Balrog and the site. This site is never discarded and never untaps for you. Before a company can play any ally or item at any version of this site, it must tap two characters during the site phase.

Cursive and bold original.

In short: I agree with Ringbearer. Tapping a site is main effect. Untapped site is condition.

In long: This site is never discarded and never untaps for you but... may be returned to Location Deck. So someone must stay here (or at least move to this site) to prevent returning the site to LD.

[Mordakai]

In long: This site is never discarded and never untaps for you but... may be returned to Location Deck. So someone must stay here (or at least move to this site) to prevent returning the site to LD.

Good point.

[dirhaval]

I am guessing that this resource on Mount Doom hinders someone testing a gold ring item
and play a ring as a result and for someone to influence the One Ring away from a hobbit
at Mount Doom so the winner of the One Ring has to play the item.

Balrog + Strangling Coils + Heart of Dark Fire + Mine or No Ones = +24 DI

[Bandobras Took]

It will not hinder the test, but will hinder the play of a Gold Ring Item as a result of the test. It will also hinder influencing items/allies away.

[Konrad Klar]

It will not hinder the playing a special item ring.
Special item ring is played by company at site, but it is not played at site. It also may be played by moving company, but it is not "played moving", per analogy.
After all, is not FW company at hero site able to play Magic Ring of Enigma (after testing Bright Gold Ring)?

[Konrad Klar]

[..]
After all, is not FW company at hero site able to play Magic Ring of Enigma (after testing Bright Gold Ring)?

Not valid argument. Special Item Ring does not tap site, so whether it is played at site, or not at site, does not matter here.

[Bandobras Took]

If the company is at the site, and an item is played with that company, they must first tap two characters during the site phase. Come to think of it, I'm not sure how this would work with items played during the organization phase (e.g. Cup of Farewell on a Hidden Haven). Are they completely disallowed?

I'm not sure that the distinction of playing at the site vs. just playing is really delineated in the rules/cards; can you think of other examples?

[Konrad Klar]

I'm not sure that the distinction of playing at the site vs. just playing is really delineated in the rules/cards; can you think of other examples?

Marvels Told played using/by sage at site - is the Marvels Told considered as played at site?

Is:
Before a company can play any ally or item at any version of this site, it must tap two characters during the site phase.
equal to:
Before a company at any version of this site can play any ally or item, it must tap two characters during the site phase.
?

[Bandobras Took]

No character at a site in a Dark-domain or Gorgoroth, or moving with a Dark-domain or Gorgoroth in his site path, can use spells, light enchantments, or rituals.

There is a difference in wording there. I think I'm going to agree with you, and will retract my previous statement.

I have a slight embarrassment of my own: Cup of Farewell doesn't allow the play of items.

In the realm of pure theory, where Eddy has been played on a Haven and then Mithril is stored there, allowing the play of items, does Eddy affect the organization phase, or only items played in the site phase?

[Konrad Klar]

I have a slight embarrassment of my own: Cup of Farewell doesn't allow the play of items.

Could you elaborate? Has it something to do with meccg-rewrite?

In the realm of pure theory, where Eddy has been played on a Haven and then Mithril is stored there, allowing the play of items, does Eddy affect the organization phase, or only items played in the site phase?

It affects all phases. But I do not think that item played in result of storing Mithril is played at site, so Eddy in Fate's Tide would not be obstacle.

You may refer to interpretation from CRF, Errata (Cards), Await the Advent of Allies.

"Playing a resource at the site" means playing a resource that taps the site or a resource that requires the site.

This is an extensional definition (it includes even a playing resources played on site), but it does not give answer.
To store Mithril a character must be at Haven, but to play resource in result of storing the Mithril other character must be just in the same company.
The second condition does not require site (remember: all that pondering are made in the realm of pure theory).

[Bandobras Took]

I have a slight embarrassment of my own: Cup of Farewell doesn't allow the play of items.

Could you elaborate? Has it something to do with meccg-rewrite?

Playable on a company at a Haven [h] during the organization phase. Once during each of your turns, you can tap a character in this company, if the company is at a Haven, to take a minor item from your sideboard into your hand (show opponent). Cannot be duplicated on a given company.

It's just to hand.

In the realm of pure theory, where Eddy has been played on a Haven and then Mithril is stored there, allowing the play of items, does Eddy affect the organization phase, or only items played in the site phase?

It affects all phases. But I do not think that item played in result of storing Mithril is played at site, so Eddy in Fate's Tide would not be obstacle.

You may refer to interpretation from CRF, Errata (Cards), Await the Advent of Allies.

"Playing a resource at the site" means playing a resource that taps the site or a resource that requires the site.

This is an extensional definition (it includes even a playing resources played on site), but it does not give answer.
To store Mithril a character must be at Haven, but to play resource in result of storing the Mithril other character must be just in the same company.
The second condition does not require site (remember: all that pondering are made in the realm of pure theory).[/quote]

I think I get. I'd better go lie down just to make sure.

[Konrad Klar]

Some analogy:
Gold Ring Items may be tested by characters in companies at site, or by characters in companies not at site (moving). And Special Ring Items may be played in result of test in both cases.
So site is not required to play Special Ring Items.

Some test cards however require site (e.g. Ringlore).
Can you say that the same Special Ring Item that could be played in result Test of Form, now requires a site, because Ringlore that allows to play the Special Ring Item requires site?