What happens with allies when a character dies?

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Papylon
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What happens with allies when a character dies?

Post by Papylon » Sat Aug 19, 2017 10:45 pm

A rather simple question my playgroup has not found an answer to. So when an ally is brought into play, it´s attached to a character, not the party as a whole. But when the character dies, what happens to the ally. Items are left behind to the remaining characters, are allies treated the same?

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the Jabberwock
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Re: What happens with allies when a character dies?

Post by the Jabberwock » Sat Aug 19, 2017 10:53 pm

No, the ally is discarded. Poor guy.

Papylon
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Re: What happens with allies when a character dies?

Post by Papylon » Sun Aug 20, 2017 12:14 pm

Thanks for the fast reply. Makes sense, but where in the rules is this written? Have searched in every possible source.

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the Jabberwock
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Re: What happens with allies when a character dies?

Post by the Jabberwock » Sun Aug 20, 2017 10:18 pm

Papylon wrote:Thanks for the fast reply. Makes sense, but where in the rules is this written? Have searched in every possible source.
You're welcome!

The CRF states "If an ally's controller leaves play for any reason, that ally is discarded."

There may be a specific reference in one of the rules books as well. If so, I imagine one of our Rules Wizards can post it for you.

Cheers

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Bandobras Took
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Re: What happens with allies when a character dies?

Post by Bandobras Took » Sun Aug 20, 2017 11:37 pm

MELE Rules wrote:RESOURCE CARDS, NON-EVENT
Certain resource cards may only be played if specific required conditions exist. A faction card, ally card, or item card must be played during your site phase and requires an untapped character and an untapped site. In addition, the company must face any automatic-attacks located at the same site before such a card can be played. Resource events do not generally require an untapped site nor that the automatic-attack be faced. This may vary based upon specific card text.

Normally, when a character leaves play, all cards controlled or on him are discarded. There are two major exceptions to this:
· Sometimes, the card that causes the character to leave play allows him to transfer an item(s) (e.g., Call of Home).
· If a character is eliminated due to failing a body check, one item can be immediately transferred to each unwounded character in his company; but the rest of his items are discarded.
Of course, this leads to the problem of followers getting discarded. Only the corruption check rules exclude followers, it seems. :) Both of the statements under Resource Cards, Non-Event and Transferring Items say that all cards controlled are discarded . . .
Remember, NetRep rulings are official. This does not necessarily mean they are correct.

You probably aren't playing Fallen Wizards correctly. This prompted the backlash erratum that I will link to as soon as I notice it is officially posted. :)

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Konrad Klar
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Re: What happens with allies when a character dies?

Post by Konrad Klar » Tue Aug 22, 2017 1:14 pm

The controversy shown by Bandobras is valid.
However CRF says specifically about an ally:
CRF, Rulings by Term, Ally wrote:If an ally's controller leaves play for any reason, that ally is discarded.
We will not speak of such things even in the morning of the Shire.

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rezwits
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Re: What happens with allies when a character dies?

Post by rezwits » Fri Aug 25, 2017 4:01 am

But let's make something clear, an Ally is not a Follower, it's just an Ally.
You probably aren't playing Agents correctly 8) <- need a rule thread for this tho...

dirhaval
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Re: What happens with allies when a character dies?

Post by dirhaval » Fri Aug 25, 2017 6:34 pm

I agree on the context of discarding followers if the controlling character leaves play. That makes things ugly. However, I then wonder why Exile of Solitude has its text the way it is. Also, there is another exception: discarding a character during the Organization phase. You cannot discard Thrain II then by default discard all of his dwarf followers too.

If the rule stands of discarding followers then that means to me the follower has lost hope in the quest when his controller has abandoned the quest since direct influence is used and not general influence. This also means to focus hazards on controllers and limit use of direct influence boosters for more followers.

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Bandobras Took
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Re: What happens with allies when a character dies?

Post by Bandobras Took » Sat Aug 26, 2017 12:57 am

dirhaval wrote:
Fri Aug 25, 2017 6:34 pm
I agree on the context of discarding followers if the controlling character leaves play. That makes things ugly. However, I then wonder why Exile of Solitude has its text the way it is. Also, there is another exception: discarding a character during the Organization phase. You cannot discard Thrain II then by default discard all of his dwarf followers too.
Why not?
MELE Rules wrote:DISCARDING CHARACTERS

Instead of bringing a new character into play during your organization phase, you may discard a character that is at a Darkhaven or at his home site. Your Ringwraith may not be discarded. You must take this action when you are forced to discard a character due to a lack of available influence. In this case, the character(s) need not be at a Darkhaven.
The rule permits discarding a character during the organization phase instead of bringing one into play. There is no rule which states other characters may not be discarded for other reasons during the organization phase (e.g. corruption check equal to total CP).
Remember, NetRep rulings are official. This does not necessarily mean they are correct.

You probably aren't playing Fallen Wizards correctly. This prompted the backlash erratum that I will link to as soon as I notice it is officially posted. :)

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the Jabberwock
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Re: What happens with allies when a character dies?

Post by the Jabberwock » Sat Aug 26, 2017 5:46 pm

Ok so maybe this topic needs a slight rule clarification.

I don't believe there is anyone in the world actually discarding followers when the controlling character leaves play.

Are there?

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Bandobras Took
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Re: What happens with allies when a character dies?

Post by Bandobras Took » Sun Aug 27, 2017 1:51 pm

I don't believe so. Perhaps the biggest problem the community faces and has faced since way back when is the ever-widening gap between what the rules actually say and what ICE probably meant.
Remember, NetRep rulings are official. This does not necessarily mean they are correct.

You probably aren't playing Fallen Wizards correctly. This prompted the backlash erratum that I will link to as soon as I notice it is officially posted. :)

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the Jabberwock
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Re: What happens with allies when a character dies?

Post by the Jabberwock » Wed Oct 04, 2017 7:58 pm

Yes, I agree.

That needs to be addressed, clarified, and put to bed.

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