Council of Elrond

The Dragons: Winds of Wrath
Rarity: Rare, Precise: R2

Hazard: Short-event

Playable only if Doors of Night is in play. Replace the new site card of a moving company with a Coastal Sea in its site path with a card from your location deck that has a Coastal Sea in its site path. "The winds of wrath came driving him, and blindly in the foam he fled from west to east and errandless..."-LotRII

How does it affect a company's site path?
Personally I have the idea:
A region containing a new new site and its region symbol are added to company's site path if not present in the path already.

The new path may be further affected by effects like effect of Hey! come merry dol! or Roam the Waste.

But I do not know what could have it impact on interpretation of other cards. And maybe there are other (better?) ideas.

Yes long ago when the game was young when region cards were more common than maiar skipping on the leaves or waves.
Reading Winds of Wrath and Chance of Being Lost have me thinking handling the original new site by its tapped status and placing only a new site. My opinion is that moving to another site is enough suffering. Reason for this is that what if you make the new site into the second to last region card? What happens to the "last" region card? That question is ignored by only changing the site.

In my proposal a region containing former new site remains.

Okay, I am moving more towards your reasoning as Galdor did during the Council.

We have to consider: company's site path, site's site path

First, I think Roam the Waste is not allowed since it is a minion,Balrog card; which I remember
the rules state Winds of Wrath and the like are not playable against minions.

Second, hero regions with sites that have a Coastal Sea other than of course the islands:
Harondor, Khand, Nurn. I wrote that to consider being able to play Coastal Sea creatures
against the doomed company. That is if you move from Harondor to Tolfalas,
the new site can be in Khand.
Original company site path: W-C Original site's site path: W-FD-C
new company site path: W-C-SL new site's site path: W-FD-C-W-SL


Reading now the CRF MECCG.pdf says Chance of Being Lost changes site path.
CoE clarifications state's company path is unaltered, but they get the new site's site path.
Then in Ruling Digest #27 the region of the newest site is used; that makes sense
since the site card lists its region. I like that reasoning.

We agree on the new site's site path is used and the new site's region name is now in play.
What remains is the company's site path.
That is when a new site is revealed; it is automatically accompanied by the regions
used for movement. I think we lost that touch with virtual gaming. Sort of like telephone booths.
But I digress.

I am deciding on how does a company's path become malleable. Of course when revealing its new site.
Wondering if including the region name of the new site mutes adding the said region name to the company's
site path. Thinking that Mountains of Shadow cannot be used if being sent to Harondor since the hazard
reduction capability is used when the hazard limit is fixed. Funny if you use this resource to move from
Gorgoroth to Tolfalas, then Winds of Wrath sends you to Nurn.


Company's site path is determined by the region cards per Standard Rules. Thus, if you change the site
then you take away the site, add the new site with its region card, if not in use already.
I would now agree with you that Hey! Come Merry Dol is reused when site is changed.
Example: Start at Tharbad to move to Isles of the Dead; W-C. Winds of Wrath sends you
to Southern Oasis in Harondor for W-C-W, but now single wilderness for company site path.

Now, what if a second Winds of Wrath is played sending the fateful company to Nurn.
Resource player uses Gates of Morning, Moon, and Stars to change Nurn to a Wilderness.
I say that Harondor stays in play and you add Nurn to the company's site path for 3 wildernesses or 1 with HCMD.

As Bilbo said, "Its near the time of lunch with all this talk."

dirhaval wrote: ↑Fri Apr 05, 2024 2:08 am First, I think Roam the Waste is not allowed since it is a minion,Balrog card; which I remember
the rules state Winds of Wrath and the like are not playable against minions.

CRF, Rulings by Term, Card Effect Limitations wrote:• Chance of Being Lost and Winds of Wrath: You may play these cards against any
opponent who is using the same type of location deck (hero sites or minion sites)
as yourself.

*

dirhaval wrote: ↑Fri Apr 05, 2024 2:08 am I think we lost that touch with virtual gaming. Sort of like telephone booths.

Rules of this game is formal system. There is no reality that would verify a validity of some rule or ruling.
A consistency is welcome but not necessary.
Not including of a region containing a new site could lead to situation where a company is considered moving to some site but is not considered moving through a region containing the site.
Winged Change-master does so but does it according to its particular text.

dirhaval wrote: ↑Fri Apr 05, 2024 2:08 am I would now agree with you that Hey! Come Merry Dol is reused when site is changed.
Example: Start at Tharbad to move to Isles of the Dead; W-C. Winds of Wrath sends you
to Southern Oasis in Harondor for W-C-W, but now single wilderness for company site path.

For Hey! come merry dol! and Roam the Waste there are no unusual consequences. If region symbols appear/change in original company's site path (i.e. before affects of the cards are applied) then the net company's site path is recalculated.

*) Lazily written. Does not address a real issue. Mere fact that FW player uses the same type of location deck as his FW opponent does not mean that he may replace overt company's new site card with hero site card.
"New site card should be a card that otherwise could be used by affected company" should be added.