Council of Elrond

CDDC - J - Seducing Nations of Men

Pool 3 + 4:
1 Blazon of the Eye (LE)
1 Fizzling Torch (NE)
1 Strange Rations (LE)
1 Hador (LE)
1 Horseman in the Night (LE)
1 Odoacer (LE)
1 The Mouth (LE)

Characters 4 + 6:
4 Indûr the Ringwraith (LE)
1 Dâsakûn (DM)
1 Grachev Hos (NE)
1 Jerrek (LE)
1 Nevido Smôd (LE)
1 Tros Hesnef (LE)
1 Ullis (NE)

Resources 35:

3 Black Steed (NE)

1 Balchoth (LE)
1 Corsairs of Rhûn (AS)
1 Easterlings (LE)
1 Haradrim [M] (AS)
1 Southrons (LE)
1 Wain-easterlings [M] (AS)

1 High Helm (LE)
2 Usriev of Treachery (AS)
3 Secret Book (AS)

1 Bade to Rule (LE)
1 By the Ringwraith's Word (LE)
1 Ready to His Will (LE)
2 Skies of Fire (LE)
2 Tribute to Sauron (NE)

3 Bold Thrust (LE)
2 Crept Along Cleverly (WH)
1 Crooked Promptings (LE)
3 Orc Quarrels (LE)
3 The Tormented Earth (AS)
1 Voices of Malice (LE)

Hazards 35:

2 Cave Worm (LE)
3 Corpse-candle (LE)
2 Ghosts (LE)
2 Marsh-drake (LE)
1 Sellswords Between Charters (LE)
2 Slayer (LE)
1 Watcher in the Water (LE)

3 Alone and Unadvised (AS)
1 Covetous Thoughts (LE)
1 Fruitless Victory (NE)
3 Lure of Expedience (LE)
1 Lure of Magic (NE)
3 Lure of Nature (LE)
2 Lure of the Senses (LE)
1 Out of Practice (DF)
2 Underneath the Shadow (NE)

2 Dragon-sickness (TD)
2 Twilight (LE)
1 Weariness of the Heart (LE)

Sideboard 13 + 17:
Hazards:
1 Ash-drake (NE)
1 Covetous Thoughts (LE)
1 Fear of Kin (DF)
2 Lost in Free-domains (LE)
1 Nameless Thing (DM)
1 Nothing to Eat or Drink (LE)
1 Rats! (LE)
1 Ring-chained (NE)
2 River (LE)
1 Seized by Terror (DM)
1 Twilight (LE)

Resources:
2 Circle of Swords (NE)
1 Crept Along Cleverly (WH)
1 Focus Palantír (LE)
1 Hold Rebuilt and Repaired (AS)
1 Horse-tamer (NE)
1 Palantír of Orthanc [M] (LE)
1 Piercing All Shadows (WH)
1 Poisonous Despair (LE)
1 Regiment of Black Crows (AS)
1 Scroll of Isildur [M] (LE)
1 Servants in the South and East (NE)
1 Skies of Fire (LE)
1 Sudden Call (LE)
1 The Arkenstone [M] (LE)
2 Voices of Malice (LE)


sites: (if you want them add them to the FW-DC-SB) they are all in the system of course
1 Oraishapek's Mound [M] (NE)
1 Caves of Ûlund [M] (LE)
1 Mount Gundabad [M] (LE)
1 Barad-dûr [M] (LE)
1 Southron Oasis [M] (LE)
1 Lugarlûr [M] (NE)
1 Wain-Easterling Camp [M] (CP)
1 Moria [M] (LE)
1 Goblin-gate [M] (LE)
1 Gondmaeglom [M] (LE)
1 Minas Morgul [M] (LE)
1 Raider-hold [M] (LE)
1 The Wind Throne [M] (LE)
1 Isengard [M] (LE)
1 Dol Guldur [M] (LE)
1 Easterling Camp [M] (LE)

I've played this deck several times recently and just wanted to share my thoughts on using the DCs and also how it compares to the original Challenge Deck. I guess the audience is a person wanting to get into DC to thinking to print a few cards and start playing. I'll try to provide some fairly obvious tips as well.

Comments
Overall, I think the deck works pretty well and it's a nice dip into DCs. The DCs that you do get are familiar, like the Steed being the same as hero. And you also get cards to solve annoying problems, like how Tribute holds your tapped sites out. And that's really it for the resource side. Nothing unapproachable. I think it was a good way to design this.

But I also think that it has some draw backs compared to the original -- its not a pure improvement. The Orc characters and factions are gone, which is a theme improvement. But then you are lacking corresponding men and MPs to make up for it in this DC deck. Of course, this DC deck is still limited by the original CD, so what can you do?

Strategy + DC Modifications

Starting Company (1) at Dol Guldur
• The Mouth controls Horseman in the Night. Hador controls Odoacer. The Mouth starts with Strange Rations and Horseman in the Night starts with Blazon of the Eye.
Comments: I would have Horseman not be a follower of The Mouth, that way either of them could be used to influence factions. There is still the +5 extra GI.
DC Comments: Grachev Hos should be in the draft pool because he is the only viable faction-marshaller besides Mouth. He is actually pretty decent if you can get the standard modifications to apply (which is not too hard). Potentially, Grachev could be used instead of Mouth, which leaves you 3 more influence for the other guys to come in, could use another Blazon instead of Fizzling Torch. In this way, you could also have Nevido vs Odo.

Suggested Sites for Resources
Usriev of Treachery - Shelob's Lair (add someone disposable) or Oraishapek's Mound (Ered Lithui). Must tap a scout to get there. Meaning you need Jerrek or Ullis.
Tribute to Sauron - Any of Easterling Camp, Raider-hold, or Southron Oasis. Play in the EoT or in the Untap phase before untapping.
The Arkenstone - Caves of Ulund or Moria (moved to SB in DC, consider moving it back into the main deck).
Balchoth - Raider-hold
Corsairs of Rhun - Raider-hold
Easterlings - Easterling Camp
Haradrim - Southron Oasis
High Helm - The Wind Throne (or Dead Marshes) -- Or Raider Hold with CBNUT. Can also use Mouth to recycle Books.
Palantir of Orthanc - Isengard (moved to SB in DC, I'd leave it there. Isengard is too far away).
Scroll of Isildur - Caves of Ulund or Moria [storing it at Barad-dur] (moved to SB in DC, consider moving it back into the main deck).
Southrons - Southron Oasis
Stinker - Goblin-gate (removed in DC)
Wain-easterlings - Easterling Camp
Great Bats (sideboard) - tapped Goblin-gate, Moria or Mount Gundabad (removed in DC)
Grey Mountain Goblins (sideboard) - Gondmaeglom (removed in DC)
Orcs of Gundabad (sideboard) - Mount Gundabad (removed in DC)

Resource Play

Original wrote: Your goal should be to play 5 of the 6 man factions at the 3 Border-holds surrounding Mordor. Essential to
playing two at one site is the minor item, Secret Book. It may become a chore moving a character to a
Border-hold just to untap it with this item, but it is often necessary. High Helm can help The Mouth or
Horsemann in the Night with their influence attempts. Pay close attention to the Standard Modifications
factions in play give. you may receive more bonuses here than anticipated. Hador plays a very important part
in the success of this deck. He casts a Powerful attack avoidance sorcery, Tormented Earth. When not
needed otherwise, tap another character to help Hador with the corruption check from this spell. Note that
Hador play Tormented Earth even if tapped or wounded. Slayers are a real threat, so save Ready to His Will
to make this creature an ally and stop its attacks. One or more companies of Orc should form at Dol Guldur.
These are responsible for playing most of the non-faction resources. Never hesitate to sacrifice an Orc to a
large attack for the greater good of Sauron.

This deck, and the original, suffers from a lack of free influence. Even if Mouth controls Horseman you are still limited. You absolutely need Bade to Rule, and maybe even BTRWord to get more characters into play. The original CD lets you use Orc Capn + Ill Fellow to create this neat 5 mind company. But this DC version does not have anything of the sort. None of the characters can control followers and none of them can really hope to influence factions on their own. In fact, I think that these guys would even have trouble collecting minor items on their own, which is something that you are likely to need to do in this deck. So I feel like the original CD is better in this respect.

Notes on Dream Cards / DC version:
Tribute to Sauron is used it to hold the tapped sites in play, letting you pick up a Secret Book elsewhere, then using that book to untap the TtS site, and then get another Book to use on another site. If playing a hero be careful to protect this site. You can potentially play the Agents as agents instead of characters. Otherwise, the deck does have many Shadow-land and Border-hold creatures, so see if that is enough.

Usriev / Horse-tamer lets you redirect strikes away from Horseman with one of your 4 or 5 prowess guys (now 6 or 7 prowess). I wouldn't put it on Hador because of the CCs from spells.

Black Steed - be sure to place these on separate characters. Hopefully Horseman, but he is often tapped and someone else is untapped. If you get the Steed on Horseman early in the game, you'll get a lot of use from it. With 2-3 Steeds you can sideboard in the Arkenstone and Scroll and easily be able to get to the sites using the extended region movement.

Lure of Magic - Not that helpful against Hero. Use against Minion and FW.

Out of Practice - A fun (for you) and annoying (for your opponent) card. I think it's worth including in all decks, at least the SB.

Servants in the South and East - This card is just a teaser. It doesn't do anything on its own in this deck, you need to add leader cards or go deeper into DC.

Additional Changes:
I'd swap BTRWW for another Bade.
Add Grim for backup Sorcery or agent.
Add We Have Come to Kill to replay Mouth in the site phase.
Add Come By Night Upon Them to play Helm at Raider. Could add Sable Shield as well. Potentially Spear is fine and easier to play that Usriev using CBNUT.
Riven gate also works well because Horseman sometimes has trouble overcoming the Auto at the borderholds.
Maybe add another Sage for Voices, like Dorelas or Nain, who could be under Indurs DI even with Bame.
Possible Cards to remove: Skies of Fire, Crooked Promptings, most of the MP items (move to SB), some of the attack cancelers (there are many, and Tormented Earth can take care of non-autos while CBNUT and Riven can help with Autos instead).
Remove some of these characters because there is no influence to play them.

Other DC cards to look at:
A Worthy Substitute - Useful in a 3-deck game to fix any Steed issues.
Bloodspike - Instead of Usriev. Will give +4 prowess to Horseman against the Autos.
Grapnel - Doesn't work because you're lacking Scouts.
Precious Burden - If you can get followers at their home site, this can use them to get the corresponding faction card that you need. Sometimes that is the biggest hang up. A small sacrifice. But this cant be used on the autos in this deck.

Indûr needs more DC love.

This deck could alternatively be a Necromancer deck. Instead of recycling sorcery with Indur, just use the cancelers you have (which seem to be enough in my experience), and then use The Unfaithful to improve your faction marshalling. This also allows the agent characters to actually marshal factions. And they have lower mind. So then swap out the MELE characters in the deck for the Agents and play them under GI. This is a completely different deck, but has the same flavor.

Some insights by why I made these changes

Arkebstone is hoard item is DC , so you have no way to play it at Moria! also it is in every minion challenge deck since it is not a rare, but a promo!

Usriev helps your horses to survive with the help of the horsetamer!

High helm is always the key to manage your GI in minion decks , if on Mouth or Grachev Hos it makes it all possible

Ways to create a leader is needed as defence vs some hazards -

yours Vastor

Vastor Peredhil wrote: ↑Tue Sep 08, 2020 8:53 pm Some insights by why I made these changes

Arkebstone is hoard item is DC , so you have no way to play it at Moria! also it is in every minion challenge deck since it is not a rare, but a promo!

Usriev helps your horses to survive with the help of the horsetamer!

High helm is always the key to manage your GI in minion decks , if on Mouth or Grachev Hos it makes it all possible

Ways to create a leader is needed as defence vs some hazards -

yours Vastor

Thanks for the comments. It would be nice if there were tips on the other decks so that it would be easier to introduce players to Dream Cards via these Challenge Decks.

I think Scroll is a bit easier/better than Arkenstone, even not using DC errata, because you can get it at Tolfalas near Southron Oasis. And if you get the Steeds, or use Rations, you can get there from Horseplains. So, I think it's worth having in the deck for the 5MP.

As for Helm, I still think it does not solve the GI issue because I found that I could not afford to have Mouth control the Horseman. Hador controls Odo for 1 free GI, and you could have Mouth control Horseman for 4 more GI (5 total). My problem was that Horseman sometimes even fails against the automatic attacks (83% or 58% chance to be untapped). Sure you have some cancelers, and Hador can take care of some non-auto attack, but I just found Horseman to be tapped. And so I need Mouth available also. Especially because I will need/want to have someone untapped for Book, or Steed, or Tribute.

Like mentioned above, Come By Night or Riven-gate (both rares) would help. Then you could have an easier time with getting Helm, the influence check, and the autos. So then you could have Mouth control Horseman. But, this is a CD...

So I have 1 free GI and Helm only gives +2 DI. +2 DI doesn't let Hador (1 DI) control the Horseman (4 Mind). And it doesn't even really let Mouth control Horseman because then Mouth only has +4 against the influence checks. I think this would be OK if I had the +2 Std. Mod. bonuses, but that doesn't always work out. You still need Bade to Rule to get characters in play. So I wish the deck had at least 2 copies of it.

Still on GI -- in the original CD, Indur can control an Orc Captain under DI while you wait to get Bade to Rule out, our maybe get BTRWWords on one of the original guys at a haven (but you are unlikely to need to go to a haven...). And the Orc Captain can form a party with the Ill Fellow and actually get work done (pick up Books, even pick up Greater at Ulund). Whereas the DC deck uses the Easterling/Southron men, who do not have enough DI to have followers, and they do not have enough DI to get the factions on their own.

Best case scenario is to play Bade to Rule, then play Grachev, then play BTRWWords on Grachev, and then play one of the Easterling/Southron men under his additional +4 DI. And I did pull this off once. But it's just not likely, and not as easy to setup as boring old Capn+Ill-Fellow.